Apearence vs Reality – Q and A

0:00 So if you would take a seat. Report an error in the passage at 0:00 Highlight the passage at 0:00

0:09 So this is your opportunity to ask questions. Yes? Report an error in the passage at 0:09 Highlight the passage at 0:09

0:21 In the Buddhist, in these traditions, it's always pointing to what we're not. It doesn't really give a defined description of what we are. If Report an error in the passage at 0:21 Highlight the passage at 0:21

0:38 it's not form or feelings or things Report an error in the passage at 0:38 Highlight the passage at 0:38

0:47 that come into consciousness. most people would say these things come in and they affect this thing that I can't find. Report an error in the passage at 0:47 Highlight the passage at 0:47

1:03 seems that the light we react, something reacts. Well, Report an error in the passage at 1:03 Highlight the passage at 1:03

1:10 this is the ultimate question that can't Report an error in the passage at 1:10 Highlight the passage at 1:10

1:18 be answered. Report an error in the passage at 1:18 Highlight the passage at 1:18

1:24 Because an answer would define... You're used to thinking of yourself always in the form of... a self or a of some sort. The Buddha, in this particular style, in the Pāli tradition, it's aimed basically to not give you any possibility of becoming anything. Report an error in the passage at 1:24 Highlight the passage at 1:24

1:56 So what it does, what actually Bhavana, or cultivating this path, is you're... Letting everything go, it's total relinquishment till there's nothing, and that's what you are. But that's not, that can sound rather stark, but it's like you're not anything you think or a physical being, but you're not a thing, in other words. Report an error in the passage at 1:56 Highlight the passage at 1:56

2:27 You're not a condition, not a person, not anything that's conceivable. And so this is where, you know, that's why you can't really conceive it or think about it. But as you cultivate this way, then more and more you recognize dharma, deathless reality, ultimate reality. You recognize it. It's real. It's not just a kind of theoretical reality or an abstract idea of reality. Report an error in the passage at 2:27 Highlight the passage at 2:27

3:02 You know, it's real here and now. And then... We're experiencing reality within the structures of the human body and then the conditioning that we've acquired, you know, like the sense of yourself as a man or as an English person, as this or that. That's acquired kind of condition. That's conventional reality. But then, you know, this is the way you're just taking, like peeling an onion, you take off layers and when you get, there's nothing. Report an error in the passage at 3:02 Highlight the passage at 3:02

3:36 But no thing isn't like, it's not like annihilation, but it's beyond conception. And this is why I refer to it usually like intuition or universal, you know, universal consciousness. It's transcendent. It's not limited and bound in conditions. Oh, it's the noumena, noumenon. Report an error in the passage at 3:36 Highlight the passage at 3:36

4:09 No, you can't, and that points to it, but it doesn't define it. You call it a non-state. And so, you know, the states are, you know, things that come and go and change. The state of mind, the state of your body, dependent on conditions, and the states are changing. The non-state is what we... You know, through letting go of the states, we begin to realize the noumena or the non-state or the non-self or non-attachment. Report an error in the passage at 4:09 Highlight the passage at 4:09

4:52 So this is where thinking has to, you have to let go of thinking. And this is the ultimate act of faith, too. It's like the monastic form is all about relinquishing. Report an error in the passage at 4:52 Highlight the passage at 4:52

5:12 You know, so it's the, you know, to be a samana, like this is a samana tradition that we're in here. It's not about becoming, it's about relinquishing. And so it's totally against the whole worldly conditioning that we have. It's like I'm conditioned, being American, I'm conditioned to attain and achieve. Report an error in the passage at 5:12 Highlight the passage at 5:12

5:41 You know, my whole ego structure, my whole sense of myself is based on the ideals of attainment, achievement, becoming, something or other. Report an error in the passage at 5:41 Highlight the passage at 5:41

5:56 And then you enter this Samana tradition and then it's about non-becoming, about non-attachment. And so this is where you're going against the whole ethos of worldly beliefs and traditions and the worldly mind in yourself and in society. Report an error in the passage at 5:56 Highlight the passage at 5:56

6:29 But it does, you know, like I find in my own experience of it, it does, you know, through this relinquishing. You know, it's like suffering is all about attaching to things. So it's like you're always frightened or worried or on the ego level. You know, there's always stress or something going wrong or possibly something will go wrong or failure or worry and anxiety. Report an error in the passage at 6:29 Highlight the passage at 6:29

7:07 Even in, as I was pointing out before, in a stable... ...affluent society that we live in, people's stress levels are incredibly high. And why is that? Because of the cultural condition, it's all about achieving and attaining and getting. And then the whole society is about becoming. Report an error in the passage at 7:07 Highlight the passage at 7:07

7:35 It's trying to prove yourself, get something, become, get more money. It's so materialistic now, you know, the idea of, you know, having all the best new things, latest model, better car, better this, better that. And the whole, you know, the government wants you to go out and spend all your money to keep for the economy. Report an error in the passage at 7:35 Highlight the passage at 7:35

8:05 You know, so you're encouraged, you're continuously being... You know, told that you should go out and spend all your money for the economy's sake. And then the time now is one of the... The ego is so strong. You know, it's such a strong sense of self-importance. My rights and what I think. And you hear it, you know, like... Report an error in the passage at 8:05 Highlight the passage at 8:05

8:40 I like to listen to Radio 4 sometimes, and they have these interviews, and they have quite interesting people talking, and it's all about trying to become, get something, improve everything, and asserting yourself, becoming somebody. Report an error in the passage at 8:40 Highlight the passage at 8:40

9:01 And then what the monastic form does is you're letting go of that, you're not becoming. And if you are, you're using it all wrong. Report an error in the passage at 9:01 Highlight the passage at 9:01

9:17 So it's like, I feel, you know, like people will say to me, you know, they see me as a person. Ajahn Sumedho's birthday, Ajahn Sumedho is retiring, and then they'll say, oh, Ajahn Sumedho, you've done so much, you know, building these monasteries. Ajahn Sumedho, you've... You know, so then, you know, this is a conventional way of looking at it. But the reality behind that is, you know, I don't feel I've done anything. Report an error in the passage at 9:17 Highlight the passage at 9:17

9:57 You know, it's not like I've, this is a plan that I've, you know, my vision and I put this plan to work here. I can't claim it. It's happened, you know, because the conditions for it to happen are present, but it's not personal. So it's through the seeing of, you know, this letting go of the self. Because, you know, whenever I see myself coming in and thinking I've done all this, I know that is not to believe in it. Report an error in the passage at 9:57 Highlight the passage at 9:57

10:36 And we all have kind of personal hang-ups. You know, we have personal weaknesses. weaknesses, so So, you know, personal, you know, living in monastic communities and, you know, we all shave our heads and put on brown robes, but, you know, there's no two monks or nuns the same. Report an error in the passage at 10:36 Highlight the passage at 10:36

11:00 They're all different. And so we have the same, you know, the Samana life, the Aum's mendicant life, but then we've got to deal with our own particular karmic... tendencies. Report an error in the passage at 11:00 Highlight the passage at 11:00

11:21 what they've like and not done. What is there to become? Except there is this knowing of, this knowing becomes stable. It's not a conceptual knowing about something. It's not knowing about Buddhism anymore. It's not... A kind of knowing that depends on conditions supporting it. It's a profound knowing. It's called, what, like insight knowledge, jnana dasana, these words. Report an error in the passage at 11:21 Highlight the passage at 11:21

12:04 So it does give you this freedom from being bound to the position or the conditions that you're experiencing through the form, you know, through the samana form. Report an error in the passage at 12:04 Highlight the passage at 12:04

12:21 One can become an egotistical bhikkhu. Report an error in the passage at 12:21 Highlight the passage at 12:21

12:31 That would be a misuse of the form. The aim of it is to not become, to let go of becoming, or see the suffering that one creates through trying to become something. Like one of the questions I put people, you know, like, It's not. Report an error in the passage at 12:31 Highlight the passage at 12:31

12:55 They say, you know, why do we practice meditation? Why do you come here? Or ask, like on a retreat, why have you come here? You know, 10-day retreat in that retreat center. And why do you come? Well, you could be, you know, lying on the beach in Mallorca or someplace. Here you're kind of crowded and jammed in this stuffy room. Report an error in the passage at 12:55 Highlight the passage at 12:55

13:26 Why do you do that? And this is, you know, And then of course the ego says, well, you know, I'm somebody that is unenlightened and I have problems and I have fears and I want to practice in order to become enlightened or resolve my problems. So this is the ego operating. We start meditating usually because We don't like ourselves or we see something's wrong with me, with ourself, and that we think maybe meditation might help. And then the, so like speaking for myself, that brought me into the monastic life. Report an error in the passage at 13:26 Highlight the passage at 13:26

14:15 And then Ajahn Chah kept, you know, pointing to the fact that there's no self. And in the sense that I'm here in order to become enlightened, suddenly I can see that is something I create. I'm not good enough the way I am. I need to practice hard in order to become an Arahant. So then you... You see that, you know, you begin to observe, you're trusting this awareness rather than believing, operating from any position, like I'm not good enough, I've got to do something in order to become somebody better. Report an error in the passage at 14:15 Highlight the passage at 14:15

15:02 You know, to contemplate that, you know, we do see, you know, the ego can be very tyrannical because usually it's very much aware of what's wrong with you, you know, what you don't like about yourself. Report an error in the passage at 15:02 Highlight the passage at 15:02

15:19 Isn't it? Your ego usually, you're more conscious of your faults or weaknesses or fears than anything. And so, you know, you want to get rid of fear, get rid of anger and so forth, because, you know, good people shouldn't be angry or jealous and frightened. They should be, healthy person is normal, happy, healthy, wealthy, wise. Report an error in the passage at 15:19 Highlight the passage at 15:19

15:52 You should be happy all the time and shouldn't be stressed. And you shouldn't be envious or jealous of somebody else. You shouldn't be frightened. You should be brave and forgiving. You should forgive your enemies and kind to everybody. And then you see, you know, you're envious, jealous, sometimes quite cruel, unkind, at least some of the thoughts one has. Report an error in the passage at 15:52 Highlight the passage at 15:52

16:27 What I'm pointing at is not to believe you don't exist, but to begin to change from operating from the ego to observing the ego. Putting the ego as a In a position as an object rather than operating always from the ego as your subjective way of interpreting experience. Because from the ego level you always get it wrong. Report an error in the passage at 16:27 Highlight the passage at 16:27

17:09 Always. Report an error in the passage at 17:09 Highlight the passage at 17:09

17:12 Ego cannot be trusted. Report an error in the passage at 17:12 Highlight the passage at 17:12

17:25 Or if I think, well, there's nothing wrong with me. I don't really need to meditate. I'm perfect the way I am. That's the ego also. But most people that I meet don't come from that position. say Report an error in the passage at 17:25 Highlight the passage at 17:25

17:42 And then in this country, the English character tends to be self-critical. It's quite self-disparaging. Because we do give so much importance to what's wrong, what we don't like. And why is that? Why do we do that? And it's because we're... Neurogene. it... Report an error in the passage at 17:42 Highlight the passage at 17:42

18:11 We all have ideas, we have opinions about how we should be, you know, as a good person, a good man, a good woman, a good mother, a good father, a good citizen. It should be. And then that's an ideal. But we've got to live with the realities of now, which is not ideal, isn't it? With what's happening, you know, emotionally, what's going on, you know, which is not an ideal. You can't have ideal emotions. Report an error in the passage at 18:11 Highlight the passage at 18:11

18:52 You know, we'd love to have always mettā, loving kindness, compassion for everybody, on fledging, on relenting, on mitigated, loving kindness. Report an error in the passage at 18:52 Highlight the passage at 18:52

19:05 That's an ideal, but this is the reality of it. Sometimes... You know, there's hardly any mettā for anybody. Report an error in the passage at 19:05 Highlight the passage at 19:05

19:18 But the awareness, you see, is what you can trust. So, like, when you hate everybody, then awareness of that. Then you're cultivating the path. You know, so you hate everybody at this moment. It's like this. Report an error in the passage at 19:18 Highlight the passage at 19:18

19:38 Or you feel guilty. You maybe hate your... You see, Report an error in the passage at 19:38 Highlight the passage at 19:38

20:02 that's pointing to the ego operating, where awareness of the ego is not taking sides or telling you what you should do, but it's knowing it. you hate them, then you feel guilty. Report an error in the passage at 20:02 Highlight the passage at 20:02

20:14 It's discerning. The ego is a condition that changes. You can't be the same personality under every moment of the day. It changes according to other conditions. The state of whether you're hungry or not or healthy or sickly or people are treating you well or treating you badly or whatever. Report an error in the passage at 20:14 Highlight the passage at 20:14

20:40 You're still the awareness. You know, your personality will change, you know, from being happy-go-lucky, loving, joyful person to being a miserable wretch because the conditions for being miserable are present. You can't be happy-go-lucky and loving and sweet when the conditions are miserable and terrible. Report an error in the passage at 20:40 Highlight the passage at 20:40

21:06 But you can be aware of the changing conditions. Now that awareness is... It's a refuge. It's the safety that we have. That's the way out of suffering. The escape hatch. Report an error in the passage at 21:06 Highlight the passage at 21:06

21:27 Also contemplate this realm, this planet, planetary system. It's so powerful, this universe. You think of yourself as your human body. And what is it? know, we're very helpless little creatures. You know, it's these soft bodies, easily squashed. You know, what if some aliens from outer space, giants, you know, started just tromping on us? Report an error in the passage at 21:27 Highlight the passage at 21:27

22:00 We'd be like termites. Report an error in the passage at 22:00 Highlight the passage at 22:00

22:09 In Thailand, they have a lot of termites. They're tiny little things with very soft, succulent bodies. And you see, Buddhist monks are not supposed to kill anything. So when the termites get into Yakuti, you know, they're so easy to kill because they've got such soft little bodies. You've got to be very careful so you don't kill them. I kept looking at the termites and wondering what that one, you know, if they have, how they see each other. Report an error in the passage at 22:09 Highlight the passage at 22:09

22:45 One termite. Or if they know what danger they're in when I'm there. Report an error in the passage at 22:45 Highlight the passage at 22:45

22:56 You know, this big clumsy oaf is stomping around. If they were, that would be a danger to their physical bodies. Well, I mean, you know, just like this universe where it's so kind of wonderful and amazing because it's so terrifying in a way. You know, just the power. ...of this universal system that we have to experience through this very limited form. And that's just the way it is. Report an error in the passage at 22:56 Highlight the passage at 22:56

23:38 You know, if you think of it in that way, you're just this soft body, you know, that could be easily squashed by a giant or a meteorite or an alien from outer space. Report an error in the passage at 23:38 Highlight the passage at 23:38

23:50 What if the sun goes out? What if the moon crashes into the earth? What if the sky falls in? What if the... There's another tsunami. What if? Earthquake. I mean, we hear all the time about floods and earthquakes and volcanoes. You know, they're not because of human problems. It's because the nature of this planet is like this. So it is a dangerous realm. Report an error in the passage at 23:50 Highlight the passage at 23:50

24:23 Like, say, the emotion of fear. This is a primal emotion. ...of this realm, fear. It's a fear realm we're experiencing. And I'm not trying to be morbid or frighten you, but just reflect, you know, it's survival, isn't it? Like, you look at, you know, the forest and see the squirrels and all the creatures running about trying to, you know, survive in the law of the jungle. Report an error in the passage at 24:23 Highlight the passage at 24:23

24:55 You know, the big fish eating the little ones and on and on like this. So we've got that same thing. If we didn't decide not to kill each other, we can create moral agreements not to kill each other. Report an error in the passage at 24:55 Highlight the passage at 24:55

25:14 So, you know, where animals can't make such agreements. But we can. We have the same feelings. Sometimes we feel like killing each other, but we can agree not to. agreements. Report an error in the passage at 25:14 Highlight the passage at 25:14

25:31 So that's where we get this sense of safety, because we have laws and regulations and so forth that we try to abide by, but there's still so many people that don't. There are criminals and murderers and stuff that you hear all the time about these kind of things going on. So the fear is a kind of primal emotion of this realm. Report an error in the passage at 25:31 Highlight the passage at 25:31

26:04 Now, being aware of fear, awareness of fear is not frightened. So that fear isn't, you know, it comes and goes according to conditions. But the awareness, you can be aware when you're frightened. When you feel frightened, you think, I'm frightened. And then you interpret it as if, you know, the fear is you. Report an error in the passage at 26:04 Highlight the passage at 26:04

26:35 But if you suddenly just... The conditions for fear have arisen. That which is aware of fear is not frightened. That's why it's a refuge. That's Buddha, buddho, you know, the awareness. Report an error in the passage at 26:35 Highlight the passage at 26:35

26:51 So you begin to investigate your own conscious experience. You're experiencing maybe anger. Somebody's insulted you and you feel anger. That which is aware of anger isn't angry. It's not anger. And so like discerning, this discernment, the paññā, is to be able to discern anger and non-anger. Report an error in the passage at 26:51 Highlight the passage at 26:51

27:24 This is, you know, the society we live in only gives us the phenomena. You know, it's about phenomena. Everything's phenomenal. It's, you know, the culture we live in, the times, the... The reality for most people is about phenomena and that's our reality is all about birth and death and change and survival and becoming, proving, getting, trying to get rid of fear or feel safe and loved and feel something that you want that you don't have or trying to get rid of. Report an error in the passage at 27:24 Highlight the passage at 27:24

28:09 You feel you shouldn't be frightened, that you should be brave. And so then you feel, I'm not very brave. A man should be brave, but I'm not. Report an error in the passage at 28:09 Highlight the passage at 28:09

28:25 So then you create this sense of, there's something wrong with me. But what I'm doing now, just pointing to this realm, is like this. This is not a realm to seek refuge in. The phenomena, there's no phenomena that will provide any security. It can give you maybe a kind of false sense of security. Report an error in the passage at 28:25 Highlight the passage at 28:25

28:51 Maybe that's better than being totally paranoid and frightened. But even at its best, we still have anxiety and worry and fear of death and loss. And all the rest that are part of every human being's experience of life. You just notice what is drama about, you know. It's not about Arahants or Buddhists. It's about people with problems. Report an error in the passage at 28:51 Highlight the passage at 28:51

29:30 You know, so you get wars and family problems, jealousies. Problems. Report an error in the passage at 29:30 Highlight the passage at 29:30

29:38 believe, Report an error in the passage at 29:38 Highlight the passage at 29:38

29:41 Corruption, scandal, scandal is always exciting, and adultery, all these fascinating, exciting things. If they just had, you know, like a Buddhist monk meditating in emptiness, it Report an error in the passage at 29:41 Highlight the passage at 29:41

30:08 wouldn't be very interesting to people. Report an error in the passage at 30:08 Highlight the passage at 30:08

30:13 But a Buddhist monk having a nervous breakdown might be. it. Report an error in the passage at 30:13 Highlight the passage at 30:13

30:29 This realm also, it is an exciting realm. It is a beautiful planet we live on. There's some sensory sensation in it. It can be so wonderful, beautiful, as well as its opposite. It can go into absolute horror and hell. Report an error in the passage at 30:29 Highlight the passage at 30:29

30:58 And so this is, you know, this... We're in this peculiar position. I don't really understand what it's about, to tell the truth. Report an error in the passage at 30:58 Highlight the passage at 30:58

31:11 But it is the way it is. And then I found in my own practice, by being aware like this, I don't suffer from it. Report an error in the passage at 31:11 Highlight the passage at 31:11

31:30 Where if I forget that and get caught up in my habits, then I can easily make my life quite miserable. Not because of any direct problems, but because I tend to worry and Report an error in the passage at 31:30 Highlight the passage at 31:30

31:48 fear and things like this. The karma of my life arises. So if I didn't have this kind of discerning ability, I would be getting old, frightened, or maybe of death. in that, you know, arises. Report an error in the passage at 31:48 Highlight the passage at 31:48

32:16 Getting dementia, Alzheimer's. Report an error in the passage at 32:16 Highlight the passage at 32:16

32:22 I don't know how many more years I'll be able to climb up castles in Portugal and ramparts. I can't do mountains anymore. Impossible. Report an error in the passage at 32:22 Highlight the passage at 32:22

32:48 I think this is to really see the way of looking. Because the Buddha gives you very good, excellent... Kind of tools to use for examining experience. It's brilliant teaching, really. And it does work. But it takes this kind of reflectiveness to observe. It's not about becoming something, becoming an Arahant. Report an error in the passage at 32:48 Highlight the passage at 32:48

33:18 You'll never become an Arahant. Personalities never become Arahants. You never become that enlightened person. Report an error in the passage at 33:18 Highlight the passage at 33:18

33:31 Because the personality is impossible for it ever to be enlightened. But there's awareness that is impersonal. Now what is that? You can't claim it as mind, but it's certainly real. It's not a precious sublime state that's dependent on everything going well. It's always here and now. Report an error in the passage at 33:31 Highlight the passage at 33:31

34:02 Whatever state you're in, or place you're in, or whoever you're with. Report an error in the passage at 34:02 Highlight the passage at 34:02

34:21 I found it very important for me to get this, what I call a paradigm, that's very clear in Buddha Dhamma, in the Pāli scriptures. Report an error in the passage at 34:21 Highlight the passage at 34:21

34:40 The unborn, uncreated, unformed, unconditioned. There's this statement. Then there's the created, the born, the formed, the conditioned. So phenomena, using English words like phenomena is like Sankara in Pāli. All phenomena is impermanent. Report an error in the passage at 34:40 Highlight the passage at 34:40

35:07 And phenomena is the body, the eyes, the ears, the nose, the tongue, the conditions of the mind, the memory, the ability to remember, emotions, feelings, pleasure, pain, neutral feelings, the whole lot. It's all phenomena. And then, would there be escape? If everything's phenomena, then there's no escape from it. Report an error in the passage at 35:07 Highlight the passage at 35:07

35:36 Is there a phenomenon? That you can find, that you can get and keep? You know, is there one phenomenon, one thing, one place that you can get to and then keep it forever? Report an error in the passage at 35:36 Highlight the passage at 35:36

35:56 But then there's reflection. All conditions are impermanent. All phenomena is impermanent. That's its nature. Then, what is it that knows phenomena? Because you can observe the body. Is the body really yours? Because you're aware of it. Report an error in the passage at 35:56 Highlight the passage at 35:56

36:20 Like your posture right now, you're sitting and you can be aware of just the pressure, of the feelings that you're experiencing in your body while sitting. Report an error in the passage at 36:20 Highlight the passage at 36:20

36:32 Now that awareness, whatever you're feeling, isn't the feeling. It's aware of the feeling. of maybe discomfort or comfort or whatever you're experiencing right now through sitting. So like sitting, standing, walking, lying down, four postures. Report an error in the passage at 36:32 Highlight the passage at 36:32

36:50 That which is aware of the body is not the body. Report an error in the passage at 36:50 Highlight the passage at 36:50

36:58 then the personality, like the ego, you know, I'm Ajahn Sumedho and I'm a good monk or bad monk, whatever, then which is aware of Ajahn Sumedho that awareness of that perception. I can discern this awareness is not Ajahn Sumedho. Ajahn Sumedho is a conventional Report an error in the passage at 36:58 Highlight the passage at 36:58

37:26 That which is aware of Ajahn, of the thought, I am Ajahn Sumedho, is... That has no name, but it's real. It's not made up. It's not dependent on kind of blissful sublime state. It's wherever you are. And then Report an error in the passage at 37:26 Highlight the passage at 37:26

38:04 this is what, you know, this which is aware and that which you can be aware of. So this realm, you know, this sense realm. So I'm pointing to the whole planetary system we're experiencing right now. Report an error in the passage at 38:04 Highlight the passage at 38:04

38:21 You know, the sun and moon and Venus and Mars and all the rest. And plus, you know, the conditions immediate to this moment, the time of day, the hot or cold or whatever you're experiencing is like this. That which is aware of that, pointing again to this awareness, sati sampacanya, Report an error in the passage at 38:21 Highlight the passage at 38:21

38:50 And then that's not taking sides on any issue. It's just aware. It's like this. And in that awareness, then we can let go of this kind of blind attachment we have to phenomena and the limitation. It's always binding us to fear of some sort. As long as you don't discern the difference, then you're kind of bound into a dying form. Report an error in the passage at 38:50 Highlight the passage at 38:50

39:34 that poem. sages, standing in God's holy fire As in a gold mosaic of a wall from the fire, a pin and a jamb Be the singing masters of my soul Consume my heart away with desire and fastened to a dying animal Report an error in the passage at 39:34 Highlight the passage at 39:34

40:03 Before I came to England, I used to reflect on this a lot in Thailand. Sick with desire and fastened to a dying animal. That's what I felt. that. Report an error in the passage at 40:03 Highlight the passage at 40:03

40:15 But Report an error in the passage at 40:15 Highlight the passage at 40:15

40:30 it gives you this, it's like relief, a sense of, you know, this way of reflecting and changing the position from the personal and just the habitual to this reflective point, then Report an error in the passage at 40:30 Highlight the passage at 40:30

40:48 you do, you know, you start seeing things in terms of dharma rather than in terms of, you know, personal. Reactions or personal prejudices, biases or whatever that we tend to usually interpret our experience from. Yes, right there. Could you say something about apparent free will as it were? If everything is conditioned and dependent on other things, then presumably all our choices and decisions are as well. Report an error in the passage at 40:48 Highlight the passage at 40:48

41:26 And we do actually make clear... decisions and choices that they do a good thing or go and sit and meditate or something like that. It seems to be a kind of sort of Well, Report an error in the passage at 41:26 Highlight the passage at 41:26

41:43 it's like the term free will is a Western concept, and it's very much part of the Western way of looking and belief. But what the Buddha's pointing to is discernment. Report an error in the passage at 41:43 Highlight the passage at 41:43

42:05 And also, they talk a lot about karma, cause and effect. So cause and effect, like the word karma, it means the cause you use has that kind of effect. To do good, then you get a good result. Do bad, you get a bad result. Report an error in the passage at 42:05 Highlight the passage at 42:05

42:36 But the thing that the Buddha pointed to is the ability for a human being to reflect, not to choose one thing over another, but to reflect. And then the wisdom, universal wisdom, can operate through these mortal forms. Report an error in the passage at 42:36 Highlight the passage at 42:36

42:59 That's why you can have Buddhas, or you can have enlightened individuals. But they're not. Like Ajahn Chah, he's a very charming person. Report an error in the passage at 42:59 Highlight the passage at 42:59

43:18 He's an enlightened master, but it didn't mean he lost his personality. But the personality was no longer a delusion. So, you know, like you have... a... Report an error in the passage at 43:18 Highlight the passage at 43:18

43:40 He wasn't deluded by it. So I remember one monk, western monk, asked him one time, you're a really charming person. He was kind of testing Ajahn Chah out. Do you need to be so charming and turn people on? He was into psychology, western psychology. What is your need that you need to charm people and that kind of thing? Report an error in the passage at 43:40 Highlight the passage at 43:40

44:12 And then Ajahn Chah said, he said, it's my magnet. He said, I use it because it attracts people and then there's a point where they might be interested in hearing the dharma. Report an error in the passage at 44:12 Highlight the passage at 44:12

44:29 Because he obviously didn't need us to go around just being charmed by him. But he could use the personality he had. In a skillful way. It's like all of us. We try to use the good conditions we have for good actions in the world. Report an error in the passage at 44:29 Highlight the passage at 44:29

44:57 But free will is very much a Western ideal. And I found the law of karma very helpful because it's a good way to explain everything. Why? Report an error in the passage at 44:57 Highlight the passage at 44:57

45:16 You know, I was brought up as a Christian where, you know, you're told you only have one life and God created everyone. He loves everyone equally. He doesn't prefer one person over another. And he created us. And so then you start wondering, well, why did he create some better looking than others? Report an error in the passage at 45:16 Highlight the passage at 45:16

45:45 Why did he create... Why are babies born that have... Defects or disabilities, you know, if we're all equal, we're all loved equally, why, you know, there's kind of a logic there, you know, so then, and you only got one lifetime, it just doesn't make sense, even to a child. Now, the law of karma, I find, then you can explain it, you know, like differences. We're working out... Report an error in the passage at 45:45 Highlight the passage at 45:45

46:20 You have to learn from the way you are. In Thailand or Sri Lanka, a place like that, they can use it as a kind of resigned, it's my karma, just a kind of passive resignation. But that's not really karma. It's not an excuse or a kind of passive resignation to justify your faults. But it's much more like... Report an error in the passage at 46:20 Highlight the passage at 46:20

46:47 Once you, you know, this is what I have to work with, this body, these tendencies, these habits, these inclinations, you know, so then I can see it in terms of, you know, that no matter what the defects are, they're what I learn from. You know, whether it's disability or disease or poverty or ugliness or... Report an error in the passage at 46:47 Highlight the passage at 46:47

47:18 Whatever, it's part of, you know, these are not obstructions to enlightenment. None of that is an obstruction. And so then you have a way of kind of learning from what you have to live with, you know, investigating, understanding it in terms of dharma rather than in terms of Personal identities comparing that you're not, you know, somebody's better off than you are and it's not fair and things like that, which tends to get very personal. Report an error in the passage at 47:18 Highlight the passage at 47:18

47:58 You know, so then it's not fair. You know, I work harder than they do and they get the raise. I don't. It's not fair. Report an error in the passage at 47:58 Highlight the passage at 47:58

48:14 And that's the personality again. Report an error in the passage at 48:14 Highlight the passage at 48:14

48:22 And then, so, like, love karma, and then discernment. Now, discernment, it's not about free will or free choice. It's like, you know, I compare it to grasping a flame on a candle. You know, so you say, oh, that flame on that candle, so beautiful, red and everything, and you grasp it. And I don't have to say, now, It is amazing Report an error in the passage at 48:22 Highlight the passage at 48:22

49:34 to me how, you know, we can... hurts, I should let go of Report an error in the passage at 49:34 Highlight the passage at 49:34

· · · silence, 1 minute

49:38 Do this within this human state. Because, you know, I used to feel very cynical before I started meditating. You know, kind of, you know, in the American system, it's so competitive. You know, it's based on ideals of equality and fairness and all the rest. But the actual life experience is all about competition. Report an error in the passage at 49:38 Highlight the passage at 49:38

50:11 And so, you know, you've got all these kind of conflicting messages all the time to deal with. So, you know, the sense of your self-worth, you know, it's always in comparison to somebody else. Report an error in the passage at 50:11 Highlight the passage at 50:11

50:31 And the discerning ability, it's never even suggested, you know, there's no wisdom. It's about success and being a winner. Getting somewhere and proving yourself and being somebody. Now this is my cultural background. But it's based on ideals of equality and fairness and we're all the same, we're all equally good and how things should be. Report an error in the passage at 50:31 Highlight the passage at 50:31

51:05 But in the nitty-gritty of daily life experience, it's all about trying to get ahead of the one in front. Report an error in the passage at 51:05 Highlight the passage at 51:05

51:15 Or the one who's coming up behind, how to stop him. Or to just give in, you know, become a drunkard or something, just because you can't stand the competitiveness. You know, just check out of the system is another way of dealing with it. But I used to work when I was in university in the emergency room. Report an error in the passage at 51:15 Highlight the passage at 51:15

51:44 Charity Hospital in Seattle. And I used to see some, you know, they'd bring in, on the weekends, they'd bring in men who were like tramps and alcoholics, homeless men usually. Report an error in the passage at 51:44 Highlight the passage at 51:44

52:04 And I'd have to clean them up, you know. And so I got to talking to some of these guys. You know, some of them were quite, you know, intelligent people that just didn't want to operate in a competitive system. Report an error in the passage at 52:04 Highlight the passage at 52:04

52:23 You know, I could feel it because when you're in university, at least when I was, it was very competitive. I wanted to always, you know, my worth was dependent on where I stood in the lineup. And so this is, you know, this is part of a cultural conditioning that forms a sense of your self-worth where... Report an error in the passage at 52:23 Highlight the passage at 52:23

52:44 The discerning ability, you can't compare it, one person to another. It's not about attainment or achievement, but learning to trust and observe, to be awake. And so it's not about, you have to compete about who's more mindful, you have to be more mindful than somebody else. And also you have to learn from the conditions you find yourself in, whether you're, you know, Paraplegic, quadriplegic, terminally ill, male or female, or young or old, or whatever. Report an error in the passage at 52:44 Highlight the passage at 52:44

53:24 Whatever, these are not the obstructions. These are not obstructions, but they're part of the path. So even if we have diseases, these needn't be obstructions. So if we see them in terms of Karma, you know, that's one way of why do I have this disability and you're so healthy. And then it's my karma. It's one way of accepting it. And I learn from it. And I have to learn from it. You know, so, you know, you have to learn from maybe good health. Report an error in the passage at 53:24 Highlight the passage at 53:24

54:03 And maybe you just look healthy. You know, we don't always, you know, and, you know, like I said. I only see you under certain conditions. Maybe only when you're looking healthy do you come here. Report an error in the passage at 54:03 Highlight the passage at 54:03

54:29 Just to reflect in this way gives you a sense of this lifetime as a human being is something to not dismiss or waste really. And it's quite Interesting that, like I've been involved in Buddhism for over 50 years, you know, back in the 1950s, 60 years now. And the 1950s, you know, there wasn't any interest like this. You couldn't have a Buddhist monastery in Great Gatistan 50 years ago. Report an error in the passage at 54:29 Highlight the passage at 54:29

55:20 It was, you know, it was kind of beginning to dawn on people, like on the west coast where I'm from, west coast of the United States, this interest in Zen Buddhism and whatnot. It was the beginning, suddenly you could feel in America, there was something awakening that didn't exist before. Report an error in the passage at 55:20 Highlight the passage at 55:20

55:46 You know, it wasn't a part of the culture, it was through the war with Japan. And the kind of American occupation of Japan, then the cultural exchange, suddenly one of the good things that we learned from Japan, occupying Japan, was Zen Buddhism. Report an error in the passage at 55:46 Highlight the passage at 55:46

56:09 And then that became quite a kind of intellectual fashion back in the 1950s. But it was a beginning, you know, it was a way of changing one's A whole kind of dualistic, rigid structure of thinking and perceiving life into a different way of looking, which was what fascinated me. And then over, you know, it was about 1955 when I encountered Zen, and then after that, you know, this growing interest in Buddhist meditation. Report an error in the passage at 56:09 Highlight the passage at 56:09

56:46 And it's because, you know, it isn't because we're interested in exotic Asian religions, it's because the wisdom is available through this form, and we need it. Report an error in the passage at 56:46 Highlight the passage at 56:46

57:03 Because we are, you know, we're going on a destruction course with our cleverness. You know, we've got... Fairness. Report an error in the passage at 57:03 Highlight the passage at 57:03

57:18 You know, the problems of overpopulation and pollution and endless, you know, the things that we human beings are, you know, destructive weapons, atomic bombs, nuclear bombs, all the rest. You know, we've used our intelligence, not with wisdom, but with the tendency to use it to make terrible weapons. Report an error in the passage at 57:18 Highlight the passage at 57:18

57:45 What is it with us that we... We spend so much money on making deadly, destructive weapons. And it's ignorance, of course. It's not understanding dharma that we create these fears and prejudices against, you know, seeing somebody who doesn't agree with us as the enemy. Report an error in the passage at 57:45 Highlight the passage at 57:45

58:09 You know, so we, you know, we're brought up in always with this sense of there's an enemy that you've got to prepare for because they're going to... Take, destroy what you have. And it's still the same, isn't it? It's the Al-Qaeda, the, you know, if it wasn't them, it'd be somebody, something else. Because that's how ignorance works. It just feeds on this ignorance, fear and ignorance. And then we have to arm ourselves with the teeth. Report an error in the passage at 58:09 Highlight the passage at 58:09

58:44 In the Cold War, wasn't it, we had, the United States had, they could over-destroy the planet, A hundred times. And the Soviet Union was about equal in its ability to destroy everything. Now isn't that intelligent? Report an error in the passage at 58:44 Highlight the passage at 58:44

59:09 Overkill, you know? And yet everybody, you know, we didn't, very few people questioned it. Report an error in the passage at 59:09 Highlight the passage at 59:09

59:20 And so then the, but then the good thing that's come out of this is a growing interest in wisdom teachings. You know, people are in the Western countries like this, suddenly, you know, seeking like wisdom teachings again. Report an error in the passage at 59:20 Highlight the passage at 59:20

59:40 And that's because of the, you know, there is an awakening. Report an error in the passage at 59:40 Highlight the passage at 59:40

59:48 And I can see it in myself, you know, just the way that my life was transformed. So just, you know, being caught up into the system and being able to To see the pointlessness of just going along with something that, because I'm conditioned to do it, you know, just conditioned to live the American dream, middle class, white man dream. Report an error in the passage at 59:48 Highlight the passage at 59:48

1:00:22 I could have just gone along with that, you know, but there's something in me didn't really felt ill at ease with that. With the position I was in, I didn't want to live like that. And it wasn't because it was bad or anything, but it was just unsatisfying. It seemed so empty and meaningless. Report an error in the passage at 1:00:22 Highlight the passage at 1:00:22

1:00:54 So, I'll stop here. Leave you to your own reflections. But I encourage you, you know, this is good stuff. And you can really... What I'm trying to do is encourage you. Because we need encouragement. Because there isn't much to encourage us in the modern material world in this direction. I'll stop now. Report an error in the passage at 1:00:54 Highlight the passage at 1:00:54